Republican Partner Wants Christianity Declared Official U.S. Religion
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D.B. Hirsch is a political activist, news junkie, and retired ad copy writer and spin doctor. He lives in Brooklyn, New York.
Real news. With snark, invective, and lots of links. Guaranteed behaving badly.
pignose4.0 May 23rd, 2015 at 8:48 pm
The reason that the Constitution is godless and the is a secular countery is because the framers looked back at the colonialists and said screw that nonsense.
Dwendt44 May 23rd, 2015 at 10:44 pm
Colonial era Europe was all ‘christian’ countries, under the ‘Divine Right of Kings’, post ‘Enlightenment’ thinkers wanted something better and the U.S. was it.
They gave us a secular government under a secular Constitution. The Law of the Land says we are not based on the christian religion.
al707 May 24th, 2015 at 1:53 am
“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other”………John Adams
jasperjava May 24th, 2015 at 2:14 am
Of course, John Adams never said that. But nice try.
granpa.usthai May 24th, 2015 at 3:06 am
-seeing as we’re making up 100% pure T American BS…ref: Samuel Adams (Uncle Sam to some)
Larry Schmitt May 24th, 2015 at 12:10 pm
I like his beer.
trees May 24th, 2015 at 8:53 am
http://www.beliefnet.com/resourcelib/docs/115/Message_from_John_Adams_to_the_Officers_of_the_First_Brigade_1.html
OldLefty May 24th, 2015 at 11:04 am
That’s why John Adams (of the The Sedition Act of 1798, which imprisoned Luther Baldwin for saying, that he “did not care if they fired [the cannon] thro’ his arse.”, of John Adam’s arrival), was not King Adams.
To say nothing of the other founders;
“Christianity neither is, nor ever was, a part of the Common
Law.” Thomas Jefferson -letter to Dr. Thomas Cooper, 1814
“Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the
introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet
we have not advanced an inch towards uniformity. What has been the effect
of coercion? To make one half the world fools, and the other half
hypocrites. To support roguery and error all over the earth.”
Thomas Jefferson – “Notes on Virginia”
.
“Shake off all the fears of servile
prejudices, under which weak minds are servilely crouched. Fix reason
firmly in her seat, and call on her tribunal for every fact, every
opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if
there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of
blindfolded fear. Thomas Jefferson – letter to Peter
Carr, Aug. 10, 1787 .
“History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people
maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of
ignorance, of which their political as well as religious leaders will always
avail themselves for their own purpose.” Thomas
Jefferson – to Baron von Humboldt, 1813 .
Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind
and unfits it for every noble enterprise.” James
Madison -letter to Wm. Bradford, April 1, 1774 .
“Ecclesiastical establishments tend to great
ignorance and corruption, all of which facilitate the execution of mischievous
projects.” . James Madison
“The purpose of separation of church and state
is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the
soil of Europe in blood for centuries.”
James Madison -1803 letter objecting use of
gov. land for churches
Whenever we read the obscene stories, the
voluptuous debaucheries, the cruel and torturous executions, the unrelenting
vindictiveness, with which more than half of the Bible is filled, it would be
more consistent that we call it the word of a demon than the word of God.
It is a history of wickedness that has served to corrupt and brutalize mankind.
Thomas Paine
“What is it the New Testament teaches us? To believe that the
Almighty committed debauchery with a woman engaged to be married; and the
belief of this debauchery is called faith.”
Thomas Paine
“All national institutions of churches,
whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human
inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and
profit.”
Thomas Paine
Dwendt44 May 24th, 2015 at 9:50 pm
Quotes from Dan Burton aren’t worth the toilet paper they are written on. His infamy is well known for distortion, exaggerating and creating quotes from our founding fathers. A legendary liar.
al707 May 24th, 2015 at 4:50 pm
Of course he did, but nice try
granpa.usthai May 24th, 2015 at 3:03 am
“any man who would choose Sunday School over a weekly visit at the ale brewery is not worthy to be called an American”……Samuel Adams, older brother to John and uncle to John Q.
al707 May 24th, 2015 at 4:45 pm
LOL, you don’t know much about John and Samuel Adams do you? John Adams was the Oldest his brothers were Peter and Elihu. Samuel Adams was not his brother, Sam was 2nd cousin to John.
Samuel Adams parents were devout Puritans and members of the Old South Congregational Church, Sam’s father was a deacon in the church, if you don’t know what a deacon is, it’s a ministry in the Christian Church. He was also a merchant. Samuel was proud of his Puritan heritage, and emphasized Puritan values, especially virtue in his political career, he also married his pastors daughter Elizabeth Checkley in 1749.
SUNDAY SCHOOL is for Children not adults, didn’t you know that? I bet Samuel Adams knew that Sunday School was for children and not adults. Nice try though
arc99 May 24th, 2015 at 6:01 pm
The personal opinions of the founders are irrelevant.
The absence of the word “god” from any article, amendment or section which carries the force of law in the United States Constitution tells me all I need to know about what they intended, e.g. god and government do not mix.
Incidentally, you might try actually reading the Constitution. It is what governs us, not the personal correspondence of the founders.
For example
Article VI
…..
The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the members of the several state legislatures, and all executive and judicial officers, both of the United States and of the several states, shall be bound by oath or affirmation, to support this Constitution; but ***no religious test*** shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States.
6660splendidday May 27th, 2015 at 9:42 pm
Not so in Texas. If you live in Texas and you are an atheist you cannot run for any government office. NADA
ChrisVosburg May 24th, 2015 at 3:31 pm
Again, cherry-picked to create an erroneous impression. Adams speaks of general moral failing, not blasphemy or ungodliness. In this sense, “religious” is simply a synonym for “moral.”
Avarice, ambition, revenge, and licentiousness would break the strongest cords of our Constitution, as a whale goes through a net. our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.
Dwendt44 May 24th, 2015 at 9:45 pm
Adams wasn’t a christian either.
al707 May 25th, 2015 at 7:25 pm
in 1796, Adams denounced Thomas Paine’s Deistic criticism of Christianity in Paine’s book, The Age of Reason with these words, saying “the Christian religion is above all the religions that ever prevailed or existed in ancient or modern times, the religion of wisdom, virtue, equity and humanity, let the Blackguard Paine say what he will”
Adams was both a Christian and an independent thinker, starting out as Congregationalist and ending his life as a Christian Unitarian.
Dwendt44 May 26th, 2015 at 1:15 pm
Adams was a Deist, not a christian. Some Deists attended Unitarian churches, perhaps for political purposes. Adams was indeed an independent thinker. His thinking included Deist, humanist, and some puritanical ways of looking at life. Some ardent christians insist that Unitarians aren’t ‘real’ christians as well. He believed that religion needs to evolve, a red flag for christians, who think that THE religion should NEVER change.Any deviation from the straight and narrow boots you out of the ‘christian’ fold.
al707 May 29th, 2015 at 5:28 pm
In a letter to Jefferson from John Adams June 28, 1813 Adams wrote “The general principles, on which the Fathers achieved Independence, were the only principles in which that beautiful assembly of young gentlemen could unite. And what were these general principles? I answer, the general principles of CHRISTIANITY, in which all these sects were united. Now I will avow, that I then believed, and now believe, that those general principles of Christianity, are as eternal and immutable, as the existence and attributes of GOD, and that those principles of Liberty, are as unalterable as human nature and our terrestrial, mundane system”…………John Adams
What to try again, because I can give you more quotes from John Adams?
al707 May 24th, 2015 at 1:46 am
“I have so much faith in the general government of the world by Providence that I can hardly conceive a transaction of such momentous importance (as the framing of the Constitution) should be suffered to pass without being in some degree influenced, guided,and governed by that beneficent Ruler in whom all inferior spirits live and move and have their being” …… Benjamin Franklin…….. Ben was one of the framers of the Constitution, who do you think Ben was talking about there, pignose?
ChrisVosburg May 24th, 2015 at 3:18 pm
Conveniently avoided: the first part of What Dr Franklin wrote to the Federal Gazette editors in 1788, which sort of gives the lie to your interpretation.
To conclude, I beg I may not be understood to infer, that our general Convention was divinely inspired when it form’d the new federal Constitution, merely because that Constitution has been unreasonably and vehemently opposed; yet I must own I have so much Faith in the general Government of the World by Providence…
al707 May 25th, 2015 at 6:18 pm
Here is more of Ben Franklin’s words, during the Constitutional Convention in June 1787 he attempted to introduce the practice of daily common prayers with these words “In the beginning of the contest with G. Britain, when we were sensible of danger we had daily prayer in this room for the Divine Protection. Our prayers sir where heard, and they were graciously answered. All of us who were engaged in the struggle must have observed frequent instances of a Superintending Providence in our favor, and have we now forgotten that powerful Friend? Or do we imagine that we no longer need his assistance. I have lived sirs a long time, and the longer I live the more convincing proofs I see of this truth, that God governs in the affairs of men, and if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without His notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without his aid? We have been assured, Sirs in the writings that “except the Lord build, they labor in vain that build it” I firmly believe this and I also believe that without his concurring aid we shall succeed in this political building no better than the
builders of Babel. I therefore beg leave to move, that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of Heaven, and it’s blessings on our deliberations, to be held in this assembly every morning before we proceed to business, and that one or more of the clergy of this city be requested to officiate in the service”
Now if I am cherry picking aren’t you cherry picking too?
Dwendt44 May 26th, 2015 at 1:08 pm
That motion to start with a prayer was rejected.
al707 May 26th, 2015 at 2:48 pm
Stay on topic,we are talking about Ben Franklin words here. You know the Ben you said that wanted a secular county.
arc99 May 26th, 2015 at 3:02 pm
you are still ignoring what the US Constitution says.. it is these words which govern us, not the personal opinions of the founders
Article VI
…..
The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the members of the several state legislatures, and all executive and judicial officers, both of the United States and of the several states, shall be bound by oath or affirmation, to support this Constitution; but ***no religious test*** shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States.
al707 May 28th, 2015 at 1:01 pm
I am not ignoring what the Constitution says, I’m just saying the founding fathers believe in God, they were not Atheist and I am quoting there words to say it.
Obewon May 28th, 2015 at 7:52 pm
You’re well proven Constitutionally and legally illiterate e.g. “U.S Ratified law: The United States was “not in any sense founded on the Christian religion”-George Washington’s Ratified Treaty is U.S. law. http://disq.us/8nggiz
Dwendt44 May 24th, 2015 at 9:45 pm
For one, Franklin wasn’t a christian. Second, the Constitutional Convention did NOT start with a prayer. That should show the willful ignorant that this is not a ‘christian’ country. That and the law of the land says exactly that as well.
al707 May 25th, 2015 at 4:48 pm
Please tell me where I said Franklin was a christian? Franklin wrote in his autobiography “Sunday being my study day, I was never without some religious principals, I never doubted, for instance, the existence of the Deity; that He made the world, and governed by his providence; that the most acceptable service of God was the doing good to man, that our souls are immortal, and all crime will be punished and virtue rewarded either here or in the hereafter”
Dwendt44 May 26th, 2015 at 1:07 pm
The point, which seemingly went right over your head, is that ‘christians’ often claim that our Founding Fathers were all christians, and that makes this a ‘christian’ country. Truth is, our first five presidents were NOT christian. Franklin wasn’t a christian, nor was Paine. They all wanted this to be a secular country, as it is under a secular Constitution. the law of the land says so explicitly.
al707 May 26th, 2015 at 2:36 pm
It was Ben Franklin during the Constitutional Convention in June 1787 who attempted to introduce daily common prayers with these words “In the beginning of the contest with G. Britain, when we were sensible of danger we had daily prayer in this room for the Divine protection. Our prayers sir where heard, they were graciously answered. All of us who were engaged in that struggle must have observed frequent instances of a Superintending Providence in our favor and have we now forgotten that Powerful Friend? Or do we imagine that we no longer need his assistance. I have lived sirs, a long time and the longer I live, the more convincing proofs I see of this truth, That God governs in the affairs of men, and if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without his notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without his aid? We have assured sirs, in the writings that except the Lord build, they labor in vain that build it. I firmly believe this and I also believe that without his concurring aid we shall succeed in this political building no better than the builders of Babel. I therefore beg leave to move, that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of Heaven, and it’s blessing on our deliberations, to be held in this assembly every morning before we proceed to business, and that one or more of the clergy of this city be requested to officiate in that service”
Does that sound like a man that wants a secular county, to you? the point is that went right over your head, is all of the Founding Fathers every one of them believed in God in their own way, even Thomas Paine.
OldLefty May 26th, 2015 at 2:58 pm
Oh, spare us.
“Christianity neither is, nor ever was, a part of the Common
Law.” Thomas Jefferson -letter to Dr. Thomas Cooper, 1814
“Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the
introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet
we have not advanced an inch towards uniformity. What has been the effect
of coercion? To make one half the world fools, and the other half
hypocrites. To support roguery and error all over the earth.”
Thomas Jefferson – “Notes on Virginia”
.
“Shake off all the fears of servile
prejudices, under which weak minds are servilely crouched. Fix reason firmly
in her seat, and call on her tribunal for every fact, every opinion.
Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one,
he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear.
Thomas Jefferson – letter to Peter Carr, Aug. 10, 1787
.
“History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people
maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of
ignorance, of which their political as well as religious leaders will always
avail themselves for their own purpose.” Thomas
Jefferson – to Baron von Humboldt, 1813 .
Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind
and unfits it for every noble enterprise.” James
Madison -letter to Wm. Bradford, April 1, 1774 .
“Ecclesiastical establishments tend to great
ignorance and corruption, all of which facilitate the execution of mischievous
projects.” . James Madison
“The purpose of separation of church and state
is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the
soil of Europe in blood for centuries.”
James Madison -1803 letter objecting use of
gov. land for churches
Whenever we read the obscene stories, the
voluptuous debaucheries, the cruel and torturous executions, the unrelenting
vindictiveness, with which more than half of the Bible is filled, it would be
more consistent that we call it the word of a demon than the word of God.
It is a history of wickedness that has served to corrupt and brutalize mankind.
Thomas Paine
“What is it the New Testament teaches us? To believe that the
Almighty committed debauchery with a woman engaged to be married; and the
belief of this debauchery is called faith.”
Thomas Paine
“All national institutions of churches,
whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human
inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and
profit.”
Thomas Paine
For just a few examples.
There is a reason why the word God or Christian does not appear in the Constitution.
granpa.usthai May 24th, 2015 at 2:58 am
it’s what happens when city planners allow a brewery to be built on the way to church!
robert May 23rd, 2015 at 9:14 pm
you might as well call it custers last stand
the gop never lets us down
Heston Churchill May 23rd, 2015 at 9:30 pm
Liberals know that a more authority centric state is better. It’s more socialistic.
Capitalism doesn’t work because religious ignorance is allowed to flourish. Each of us needs more government, in each of our lives.
–and it really does take a village. And Federal authorities are better trained in management of lives.
That’s why, with Climate, we need more *regulation* in *each* of our lives. John F. Kerry, Henry Ried, Ed Asner, Phil Donahue and Hillary know best for you and me!
Hirightnow May 23rd, 2015 at 10:21 pm
Oh, look; it’s a troll from MMfA, seeking attention,
Well, here’s your nickel.
Heston Churchill May 23rd, 2015 at 10:27 pm
I’m a Media Matters’ astrophysicist tonight ready to argue the conservatives.
allison1050 May 23rd, 2015 at 10:34 pm
Knock yourself out Heston. ;o/
Guy Lauten May 24th, 2015 at 2:20 pm
You’re a fraud and a paid troll for Roger Ailes. And not a very good one at that. Try lifting your head away from Faux Noos for a month and then MAYBE someone around here will gives 2 shits about what you and your ignorant trolling-ass thinks.
Heston Churchill May 24th, 2015 at 7:00 pm
Leave the free world and into the stock comic book mind of the left?
It’s uninteresting, at best. Nauseating, of maximum likelihood.
OldLefty May 24th, 2015 at 7:18 pm
You mean because the right has already done so much damage??
Heston Churchill May 24th, 2015 at 7:20 pm
Not quite, so much freedom, more likely, from your vantage point.
OldLefty May 24th, 2015 at 7:21 pm
Thou dost project too much, Methinks.
Neurotic projection is perceiving others as operating in ways one unconsciously finds objectionable in yourself.
Heston Churchill May 24th, 2015 at 7:26 pm
Every thought we have is but a “projection”, my friend.
It’s the model projected, that’s your character.
Like the laws of physics, truth is predisposed toward simplicity.
OldLefty May 24th, 2015 at 8:03 pm
Lots of $10 words for two bit thoughts, but is really has nothing to do with the subject at hand and seems to be a nice red herring after hurling concrete accusations.
granpa.usthai May 24th, 2015 at 2:55 am
-and why gubermint should decide what a woman will chose concerning her own body, and who you’re permitted to love?
anothertoothpick May 23rd, 2015 at 9:41 pm
The religious fundies are ……whimsical today.
Obewon May 23rd, 2015 at 11:04 pm
Next they’l insist the 4.5 B year old Earth & 13.8 B year old universe were both born on Sunday October 23, 4004 BCE! https://www.lhup.edu/~dsimanek/ussher.htm
Dwendt44 May 24th, 2015 at 9:41 pm
And the y don’t bother reading that book either. they just take what B.S. some cleric spouts on the TV set or the radidio.
Jake May 23rd, 2015 at 9:45 pm
Does that mean child rape will no longer be a crime?
Guy Lauten May 23rd, 2015 at 10:19 pm
“The American church”??? Is that anything like the US bank?
Heston Churchill May 23rd, 2015 at 10:28 pm
I just really wish for all of us just to sing. All of know, that really, only government knows best for you and me!
OldLefty May 24th, 2015 at 7:42 am
Do you have ANY idea what you are talking about???
Heston Churchill May 24th, 2015 at 9:52 am
I am singing – the principles of liberalism.
OldLefty May 24th, 2015 at 10:03 am
The ACTUAL ” principles of liberalism.”, or the FICTIONAL “principles of liberalism”?
Not sure you know the The ACTUAL ” principles of liberalism.
Heston Churchill May 24th, 2015 at 7:03 pm
Principles of liberalism are practiced by today’s Conservatives.
Liberalism today is living your life as a victim and a judge, at once. As a resentment trapped inside a rationalization, a dysfunction.
Ted Cruz is more liberal than any democrat.
OldLefty May 24th, 2015 at 7:10 pm
Principles of liberalism are practiced by today’s Conservatives.
_______
Sorry, but is is EXACTLY the opposite.
Conservatism is actually is living your life as a victim and a judge, at once.
A victim of blacks, of women, of gays, of the media, of the poor, of the browns and of the liberals.
Sanctimonious judges of ANYONE who does not agree with you.
Ted Cruz is a buffoon, and most likely would not know a conservative from a liberal.
As Bruce Bartlett said:
“I still consider myself to be a conservative in the tradition of Edmund Burke, Russell Kirk and William F. Buckley. I don’t think most of today’s conservatives have any idea who those people were.”
Heston Churchill May 24th, 2015 at 7:13 pm
Yep. We’re all victims and judges. ha ha
CandideThirtythree May 24th, 2015 at 9:13 pm
https://a.disquscdn.com/uploads/mediaembed/images/2084/5674/original.jpg
Jeffrey Samuels May 24th, 2015 at 9:34 am
Any Jewish person with a modicum of intelligence and integrity would disassociate him or herself from any connection with a party that aligns itself with someone advocating second class citizenship for Jews or forced conversion. We have experienced this kind of ‘Christian Love’ for millennia and it has never worked out well.
Angelo_Frank May 24th, 2015 at 12:16 pm
“building an army of conservative pro-faith activists…”
Sounds like a bunch of militant extremists out to do damage to our country.
Dwendt44 May 25th, 2015 at 12:14 am
Onward christian soldiers, marching as to war,…
David Ish May 25th, 2015 at 10:13 am
He can start by start by doing Christ’s orders. One of them: is the give ALL to the poor. Priebus, Lane and ALL “Born again” types would rather see their daughters and granddaughters rape than obey that one.
Dwendt44 May 25th, 2015 at 11:27 am
Don’t hold your breath waiting.
Interesting that there’s not ‘commandment against rape.
Obewon May 28th, 2015 at 7:48 pm
U.S Ratified law: The United States was “not in any sense founded on the Christian religion”-George Washington’s Ratified Treaty of Tripoli, as signed into law by 2nd POTUS John Adams! Vs the airhead party “ Declaring Christianity the “official religion of the United States“-D’oh! http://freethought.mbdojo.com/foundingfathers.html